Deadly Creatures developer 'back to minigames' if game doesn't sell
by Chris Greenhough 
{ Jan 7th 2009 at 8:05PM }
It's tough being a developer at Rainbows Studio right now, and not just because your rivals are insinuating things about your game. Jordan Itkowitz, lead designer on the allegedly not-that-original Deadly Creatures, is desperate for his game to sell well. If it flops, as many third-party "core" games have to date, it could mean he goes "back to minigames." Says Itkowitz to MTV's Multiplayer blog: "I hope people vote with their dollars in February so we can make some more."
Well, us too, Jordan. Now, let's all take a moment to dwell on what a bleak, bleak statement this makes about the current state of the Wii software market.
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Dustin @ Jan 7th 2009 8:24PM
Is this a tug-at-your-heart marketing strategy?
Kenology18 @ Jan 7th 2009 8:30PM
What kind of bleak statement do you take this to make about the Wii software market, Chris? It seems incredibly healthy to me, the numbers don't lie. And really, it's back to mini-games for a whole bunch of publishers if they're games don't sell... Itkowitz ain't special, so please don't try to make him out to be! If Deadly Creatures is a great game, which hopefully it is (it's on my to buy list for February), and it gets some exposure (which I'm not bankin' on given THQ's recent history), the game will do well.
Chris Greenhough @ Jan 7th 2009 8:57PM
"What kind of bleak statement do you take this to make about the Wii software market, Chris?"
Itkowitz's statement seems to imply that publishers are becomingly increasingly reluctant to take a gamble on more esoteric, unusual ideas.
mr nimblewick @ Jan 7th 2009 8:34PM
What are these 3rd party "core" games that have flopped?
No More Heroes? It's getting a sequel.
Zak & Wiki? That would have flopped on any system.
And, to be fair, so would Deadly Creatures.
Chris Greenhough @ Jan 7th 2009 9:04PM
As you say, Zack & Wiki for one. de Blob. Blast Works. Disaster: Day of Crisis. Opoona. And to add a Nintendo title to that: Captain Rainbow (in Japan, at least).
I would never suggest that there aren't exceptions to the rule, but it does seem to be the case for the majority.
Mr Khan @ Jan 7th 2009 9:23PM
de Blob is currently pushing over 670k in sales. The rest you're right about, mostly
Gun Barrier @ Jan 7th 2009 9:51PM
@khan
wow really?! im glad that deblob is doing great. It really deserves great sales, what a great game.
samfish @ Jan 7th 2009 10:34PM
Zack & Wiki is not, once again, a flop.
mr nimblewick @ Jan 7th 2009 10:48PM
So that leaves us with Blast Works, Disaster: Day of Crisis, and Opoona.
I heard Opoona sucked. The bear boss fight was enough of Disaster for me, and... I haven't actually heard of Blast Works. Did any of them even come out here?
Anti-Villian @ Jan 8th 2009 12:11AM
Day of crisis was awful, I was expecting a thrilling shooter, I was met with a series of mini games that took itself too seriously.
SoshiKitai @ Jan 8th 2009 1:25AM
"I heard Opoona sucked. The bear boss fight was enough of Disaster for me, and... I haven't actually heard of Blast Works. Did any of them even come out here?"
Yeah, they came out there.
Opoona was different, not sucked. It was actually well made and great in many aspects - but definitely not for several crowds (almost too specifically different is what made it "suck"... and when people say the controls sucked, they never tried using the classic controller :P).
And you not hearing of Blast Works is a good example of how a core game flopped. :P Go look up YouTube videos.
Anti-Villian @ Jan 8th 2009 1:48AM
Blastworks? Hardcore?
I did what you said, that is undoubtedly an arcade game. Hardcore arcade? O.o
SoshiKitai @ Jan 8th 2009 2:18AM
Never said hardcore. I said "core". Two different things.
A core gamer appreciates games that take more than an hour to play. While a casual would love to just keep it around an hour. And a hardcore? Well, depending which system/game you're talking about, a hardcore could just mean a gamer who wants to spend COUNTLESS HOURS on a game...
And though the blasty-blasty of blastworks is that of an arcade game, the building and sharing feature of the online community is obviously time-consuming. Easily beating the one-hour mark.
Think of your favorite arcade game... now if they added a "custom build everything from the ground up"-feature, it wouldn't be that much of an arcade game at that point. (btw: Racing games that allow you to mod your vehicles doesn't count. That's modding, not building)
Anti-Villian @ Jan 8th 2009 2:53AM
Oh ok, I always assumed 'core' was short term for 'Hardcore'
BTW, blast works looks fantastic, I am certainly putting it on my wishlist.
Nigeria @ Jan 8th 2009 6:05AM
At no point does Disaster take itself too seriously.
At one point the main character outruns a tidal wave - or tsunami - then rolls his eyes like it's Tuesday. Also, you can unlock Hawaiian t-shirts. Hawaiian t-shirts. Dude.
kaoleidescope @ Jan 8th 2009 6:08AM
I would chalk up the poor performance of Blastworks on the huge variety of shmups on the VC.
On a related note, to those of you now looking to purchase Blastworks: RENT BEFORE YOU BUY.
I love shmups, and bought Blastworks on the strength of the reviews. I HATE this game. It just doesn't feel right. Everything feels so flat and muted. The weapons are weak, the enemies are weak, the sound effects are dulled, the colors are bland.
Clearly, there are huge fans of this game. But take it from one person who loves the genre but hated this game: Approach with caution.
guttertalk @ Jan 8th 2009 9:51AM
I'm not sure what defines a flop--bad game, bad sales [which is relative to expectations] or both.
But Zack & Wiki is a great game, but Capcom did a poor job pushing the game. If it would have failed on any system, it would be for that reason and not the game itself.
And Zack & Wiki has sold more than NMH (530,000 vs 390,000).
After a rather dry last 6 months, games have something of a tough time ahead of them as some Wii owners have left the console for other grounds. So, they will have to work that much harder to bring them back. And that will happen when there's a certain threshold of excellent games, not just a single one here and there.
It's like the cooperative market principle in which a business needs similar businesses around it to succeed (like restaurants and retail stores).
Fortunately, I think that theory gets some good testing as Deadly Creatures, Tenchu 4, House of Dead, Dead Rising, and Madworld are coming out in February and early March. (I'd be tempted to throw in Little King's Story and Rygar.)
Give gamers even 6 or so solid hardcore games each quarter, and I think those gamers who left it would come back to the Wii.
mr nimblewick @ Jan 8th 2009 11:08AM
"Deadly Creatures, Tenchu 4, House of Dead, Dead Rising, and Madworld"
What's funny is that I'm not interested in any of these games either. Little King's Story is on my list though.
Anti-Villian @ Jan 8th 2009 12:36PM
"At no point does Disaster take itself too seriously.
At one point the main character outruns a tidal wave - or tsunami - then rolls his eyes like it's Tuesday. Also, you can unlock Hawaiian t-shirts. Hawaiian t-shirts. Dude." - Nigeria
I was fed up with the game long before I experienced any of that.
richrdlumpkin3 @ Jan 7th 2009 8:35PM
Well, I hope the game is good because that's the only way they're getting my money. Here's to great gameplay!!!
megapenguinx @ Jan 7th 2009 8:37PM
Well make a good game and maybe you won't have to go the mini game route. On the other hand a mini game collection will probably outsell this 10-1
Azsro @ Jan 7th 2009 8:59PM
Deadly creatures really would have flopped on any system.
It will sell very poorly. What do you expect? Its a game about a spider and a scorpion! They have no appeal whatsoever.
Why dont they just make an Resident Evil 4 clone already? I would love one!!!
Change the setting, weapons and enemies. Keep control style (even the tank-turn) and pace. Create any story to match and there you go!
likedonduan @ Jan 7th 2009 10:54PM
So true!
SoshiKitai @ Jan 8th 2009 1:25AM
Booo to clones. Never encouraging new ideas. Booooo.
Azsro @ Jan 8th 2009 6:42AM
Hey, at least they could make some money with it, and experience an spider-and-scorpions-living-together game after that.
And i could have some fun playing a game.
guttertalk @ Jan 8th 2009 9:54AM
The sameness is why I'm bored with FPS and the 360 in general.
If the spider and scorpion have depth, then I think it's a potentially a great appeal.
igorponweed @ Jan 7th 2009 9:07PM
Well, this sucks. I don't have that much money right now, so I really can't buy it.
Arg!
Blue_Falcon @ Jan 7th 2009 9:07PM
I do hope this game is good and sells really well. Maybe this could reverse the minigame trend. That would be nice.
Muffonious @ Jan 7th 2009 9:11PM
I hate how whenever people hear that the game is about a scorpion and tarantula they're like, "omg fail" because it doesn't involve shooting and a screen full of blood with people dropping the f-bomb around every corner. How do you expect the Wii's market for hardcore games to prosper (and thus produce, I don't know, MORE HARDCORE GAMES) if you don't take a chance and actually try them? People whine about how all the games that come out for Wii are casual or Metroid, Mario and Zelda, and then something original like Deadly Creatures or something like it comes along and people are like, "so how many hookers can we kill in this game?"
I hope that the game does well, because I'm throwing alot of my support behind it and I'm glad that there are some developers pushing to get more interesting titles out for the Wii that aren't all waggle and shake. No More Heroes was a victory for this type of game, and some people may say that de Blob was and maybe even World of Goo, so I'm pushing for Deadly Creatures to become one, too.
ChromeAlchemist @ Jan 7th 2009 10:18PM
Unfortunately, the general mindset with gamers probably always will be to go for the game they are convinced will be good, rather than the original IP, and this may never change.
I am making efforts to buy original titles, but unfortunately I tend to be a rather poor man, so if I buy these games, then they tend to be used titles, or ones from Amazon and various places which I have no idea whether or not the devs get their cut on it.
Anti-Villian @ Jan 8th 2009 12:17AM
Muffonious I love you, Unfortunately I think people will take this game at face value and think its some kind of educational game like I did when I first saw the title and box art. The idea of arachnids fighting was a bit out there even for me!
This game will succeed if they put the dollars behind its marketing.
Muffonious @ Jan 7th 2009 9:17PM
Well on the 360 or PS3 it would have done horribly no doubt, simply because there's not enough pints of human blood on screen at all times and there's a lack of bullets and chainsaws, but on the Wii it could swing two ways:
1. People dismiss the game as another failure without even trying it because they've declared the Wii as a casual system only and the game sells poorly.
or
2. The hardcore gamers that have been suffering through the drought (especially the holidays, what a horror they were) all buy it and find that it's actually a nice change of style or maybe not all that great, but at least they tried it out and encouraged game developers to make something other than ping pong or something.
Don't just dismiss it. Whine and moan about lack of hardcore titles on the Wii and then just skip out on them when they finally role around because you're not playing as a PERSON? What?
Azsro @ Jan 8th 2009 7:20AM
Im not dismissing. But a spider and a scorpion really have no appeal.
If the game turns out to be good, im the first one buying.
But the chances are pretty slim... Its a scorpion, for god sake! There´s nothing more he can do besides sting people in the legs and run!
I know there´s probably no people in this game, but you got the point.
Im not saying you got to replicate the X360/Ps3 games on wii. I look at these systems 2009 calendar and see NOTHING that i want. Just a bunch of im-too-shooters-with-everything-brown-all-around. For me its really wii or nothing, and there´s A LOT of games im waiting for this year.
But jesus, if people want to try more core content on the wii with this kind of pressure on their heads, they should consider taking a safer path.
I dont know, get some wii twists in your bread-and-butter 3rd person shooter, without just being horrible waggle! Get the player to punch its own heart (with wii motion plus) to activate a weapon or whatever.
And while we re at that...
Create smaller enviroments but more interactive ones. Get bigger characters on the damn screen. Make an action game with adventure bits that can have a lot of different (and great) weapons without being too violent. It cant be that hard, and its a pretty safer way for a developer with the rope around its neck.
guttertalk @ Jan 8th 2009 10:02AM
"There´s nothing more he can do besides sting people in the legs and run!"
Have you read the previews? First, you'll have a very wide range of enemies--rats, lizards, beetles, wasps. Those differences imply flight vs ground, armored or not, quick strikes, sneak attacks, etc.
Second, your attacks involve combining light and heavy attacks as well as blocks, which apparently will need to change depending on the enemy. You can also switch between the scorpion and spider, and you have unlockable attacks.
Do folks not read about games? Or just look at the box art and screenshots?
Anti-Villian @ Jan 8th 2009 12:44PM
"Do folks not read about games? Or just look at the box art and screenshots?" -guttertalk
They just look at the box art and screenshots, seriously most people do, you think there is a large population out there reading and watching reviews but the bulk of the market don't bother.
Azsro @ Jan 9th 2009 7:09AM
"Have you read the previews? First, you'll have a very wide range of enemies--rats, lizards, beetles, wasps. Those differences imply flight vs ground, armored or not, quick strikes, sneak attacks, etc.
Second, your attacks involve combining light and heavy attacks as well as blocks, which apparently will need to change depending on the enemy. You can also switch between the scorpion and spider, and you have unlockable attacks. "
Wow! Light and heavy attacks! Unloackable attacks
Never saw this on a game before!!!!!!!!!
Really, a truly innovative game.....
Jesus, people! Get your act together! Even Iron Man worked this same way!!
For now on, this game will be know as "Spider-and-Scorpion in Iron Man land"
Muffonious @ Jan 7th 2009 9:18PM
That last post was supposed to be a reply to Azsro's post, but it didn't work for one reason or another.
intro94 @ Jan 7th 2009 9:22PM
if the game is good i will get it, simple as that.
Mr Khan @ Jan 7th 2009 9:26PM
with proper marketing, this game could do quite well. You have to understand that Wii games have this thing called "legs" meaning that they (gasp) actually sell after the first two weeks on the market. It has saved many a game that would have been an abject failure (and was declared as such by jump-the-gun observers all over), and has caused many to handily beat sales expectations
Don't count this game out until, oh, next October
Matias @ Jan 7th 2009 10:35PM
I'm sad that what Itkowitz said it's true. I stoped getting new games for my wii months ago (except for wiiware like megaman 9), and It's the only console that I own (aside form a ds) because of my blind nintendo fanboy-ism.
Luckily, hope is not lost yet, after reading the Q1 releases, this lack of third party core games will be gone for some time. If buying deadly creatures (wich doesn't seem that bad) encourages third-party developers to release core games, I'll buy a copy.
samfish @ Jan 7th 2009 10:38PM
I've given up on voting with my dollars. It never works and there's no point.
*samfish swears he isn't bitter about Okami*
SoshiKitai @ Jan 8th 2009 1:27AM
It works, but everyone has to do it.
...sadly for Okami, barely anyone did it. *sigh*
Matias @ Jan 8th 2009 6:05PM
I'm sad nobody played okami too, it's probably one of the best games I played this decade, maybe I ever played (and hell I have played lots of games)
Muffonious @ Jan 8th 2009 9:12PM
I'm actually currently playing Okami on Wii. I loves it.
samfish @ Jan 7th 2009 10:36PM
There's no way this'll sell more than 300,000 copies. I hope they had modest expectations...
I'm all for publishers and developers trying new and unique things and finding some level of success, but if they're honestly pinning their hopes on a game about a couple of bugs, they're nuttier than a squirrel.
kaoleidescope @ Jan 8th 2009 6:14AM
Totally agree. There's nothing wrong with trying something different, but if you produce something that's too far out there, it's not going to sell well. This holds true is all industries.
These guys should have put their efforts to creating a fun, innovative game that is commercially viable.
Yet they didn't, and now they're going to pout and threaten to make shovelware. Grow up, guys!
TracerBullet @ Jan 8th 2009 7:47AM
Problem is, you can't have that: it's a mantra heard in several companies: "different, but not TOO different". It doesn't work. You have to REALLY try things to move any industry foward.
See SimCity, for instance: a game without an end, that one could not win. Still, became one of most successfull series in the field. Or World of Goo; it's not praised for being a game like many others.
Take the racing genre: we have "Nascar Kart" and "MySims Racing" coming. Two "Mario Kart Wii" clones. That's what we get when we stick to proven formulas.
More power to those who try really different things.
samfish @ Jan 8th 2009 9:40AM
The difference, though, is that Sim City was basically a whole new genre when it first released. Certainly it was the game hat defined a genre that previously had no definition, at least. It tried something unique, yes, but it was something SO unique that it brought in whole new audiences.
Deadly Creatures is, by all accounts, a platformer with some beat 'em up elements. In that sense, I don't think it's exactly fair to compare them, since Sim city attracted people to a whole new genre. Deadly Creatures just has an interesting/unique scenario.
Sure, it could attract a whole new audience...but it seems a bit improbable, is all.
ejamer @ Jan 7th 2009 11:10PM
Wow, reading the actual interview gave me a very different impression than just reading this WiiFanboy article. The dev team sounded much more upbeat about Wii than I had assumed, overall.
I hope that Deadly Creatures ends up being a good game, and gets the sales that it deserves... but want to emphasize that neither half of that equation is automatic. Many third-party Wii games are mediocre at best, and there have been a couple good ones slip through the cracks (especially new IPs).
Best of luck to Rainbow Studios. I'll be eagerly waiting to learn more about Deadly Creatures whenever it does arrive in stores.
8-bit.artist @ Jan 8th 2009 4:44PM
i think what people are saying about how this gameplay idea is dumb and wont be fun was exactly what was said with say Katamari Damacy. honestly, did anyone actually think rolling a ball around picking stuff up with it would have been that fun?