DS Daily: Forced stylus
The touchscreen is awesome for certain types of games. Adventure titles, for example, really benefit from the DS's stylus controls.There are some instances, though, in which the stylus just seems forced, as if the developers added in these controls simply because their game was made for the DS. Most of the time, fortunately, these games will have d-pad options also, but sometimes they don't.
Have you run into any games where the stylus controls were clunky and unnecessary? If so, which titles are the worst offenders?
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Roto13 @ Apr 27th 2008 10:42AM
Pokemon D/P doesn't really gain a lot by having stylus controls. Especially when you keep switching back and forth between the stylus and the D-pad to battle and move around.
Of course, this entry could have been made specifically about Mario 64 DS. :P First DS game ever and the touch screen was implemented so poorly for the main game. Using the touch screen as an analog stick? Yeah, that doesn't work.
Sam @ Apr 27th 2008 12:52PM
Dude d/p gained ALOT from touch controls, what's best about them is they thought, "dude, why use the stylus, lets make the buttons thumb size!" and I will forever thank them for that.
one game that really suffered from touch controls was Lost Magic, you can't be fighting enemies, drawing spells, AND point and click walk all at the same time with the touch screen. I don't know if there were any button controls in that game at all.
Roto13 @ Apr 27th 2008 1:31PM
Only a cave man would touch the touch screen with their fingers. Eww.
Misty @ Apr 27th 2008 9:17PM
D/p was my first thought too. But I think there are places in it that do benefit - the underground digging in the wall, for example. I know I'm a minority, but I really enjoy that. :) There were also a few places it was requred that annoyed me, like contests (Which, overall, were pointless and not fun).
Homerun @ Apr 27th 2008 10:53AM
OBJECTION!
The mini games were great (I think) for the touch screen so its a wash for Mario 64DS.
John B. @ Apr 27th 2008 11:22AM
It was either Sonic Rush or Sonic Rush Adventure, maybe both, I can't remember off the top of my head. Anyway, the entire game was played with just the D pad and 4 buttons, stylus completely optional. However, to get into the game at all you had to get past the "Touch screen to start!" screen at boot up. You couldn't press start or anything. It isn't a big deal at all, it just seems...silly. A button controlled game, but you must touch the screen to start.
And I still say Phantom Hourglass should've used normal controls.
Puddles @ Apr 27th 2008 11:38AM
You're kidding! Phantom Hourglass was a model of what touchscreen controls should be. It was perfect.
Lilinka @ May 3rd 2008 1:43PM
If the model of how touchscreen controls should be is forcing them onto the consumer for better or worse, count me out. Ninja Gaiden DS features good touchscreen controls, Legend of Zelda? I'd prefer buttons, thanks.
Darklighter @ Apr 27th 2008 11:24AM
Star Fox Command should have allowed players to use the face buttons
Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles is awkward because it uses everything and I would rather just use the buttons.
Mario Hoops was more fun with just the buttons as was metroid prime hunters (that game should have had the option of lock on)
Pretty much any game that uses the stylus would have been better with just the buttons. At least developers should give hardcore gamers the option to play the game normally.
tamriel @ Apr 27th 2008 2:09PM
I second over FFCC. Playing alone, there was no way to not get beaten to pulp while trying to stack casts (which is the way to cast the higher-end fancy spells), switching back and forth between the touchscreen and the digital controls. Fortunately, the touchscreen could be used without the stylus.
Another game that could have received optional button controls is Puzzle Quest. As it was, the touchscreen controls were usable, though a bit cramped. Thus, playing during a shaky commute is a bit prone to fumbling.
Alisha Karabinus @ Apr 27th 2008 3:51PM
Third for FFCC. I wish devs wouldn't try to put in SOME touchscreen functionality just for the hell of it. They need to QC things like that a little mor -- it gets irritating when you have to do only one thing with the stylus when you're in a hectic moment.
Roto13 @ Apr 27th 2008 9:58PM
Being afraid of new ways to play doesn't make you hardcore.
Kassu @ Apr 28th 2008 8:30AM
The god damn tribe moves in FFCC drive me nuts. It's impossible to use them in combat.
SabreCat @ Apr 27th 2008 11:34AM
I keep seeing fans crow about how cool touch screen control is for strategy games, but I found the stylus to be a royal pain for Advance Wars: Dual Strike. The menu items and grid spaces were too small to hit accurately. So in the end I just used the D-pad, and things went much better.
Pizza Pasta @ Apr 27th 2008 12:02PM
I dislike the FPS controls on the DS. I like the fluidity of the stylus for looking around but I find it kind of awkward having to hold the system with only my left hand.
This kind of ruined MPH for me and I'm still holding off on my copy of Dimentium because of it. It just makes me feel like I have carpal tunnel.
mr nimblewick @ Apr 27th 2008 12:31PM
Try wrapping your stylus-hand's ring and pinky finger around the DS help hold it up. This also helps you hold the stylus closer to the screen.
Dio @ Apr 28th 2008 4:52PM
Get a stand.
Pizza Pasta @ Apr 28th 2008 8:01PM
I was thinking about getting a stand. They're kind of goofy but I hear they work well.
Gendreavus @ Apr 29th 2008 2:17AM
Or you could, you know, use the thumb strap that came with your DS? Although I no longer own a copy of MPH, my decision to trade it in was based entirely on the fact that the story sucked and that I didn't have time to master the multiplayer. The controls were excellent, although I would agree that a lock-on would have been beneficial.
Also, saying that the story-mode touch screen controls for SM64DS were 'forced' is just dumb. You could choose between using the touch screen or the buttons, so there was no forcing involved at all.
Pizza Pasta @ Apr 29th 2008 8:43AM
Ha, that thumb strap is loooooong gone. I have no idea where it went but it dissapeared soon after I got my first DS.
I'm just going to have to man up and take the pain.
miles @ Apr 27th 2008 12:58PM
i have a couple.
the only sudoku game that does it well is Brain Age, all others either make you use the stylus or have an option to use the d-pad, def forced when stylus is the only option to pick and choose numbers.
Super Mario 64 DS, i feel everything worked fine, but the game forcing you to use the touchscreen for the menus was a very annoying feature, especially when finding out where you haven't gotten those last few stars.
Magical Starsign, you can use the D-Pad but you can only walk when using it, using the stylus you can run, thus making the stylus in a way forced, unless you want to double the time it takes to beat the game.
Morose @ Apr 27th 2008 1:02PM
I'm with John B on Phantom Hourglass. I kept wanting to use the D-pad, because it was a Zelda game, and it felt really odd to have the pad bring up the map and menu when I was trying to move around the screen.
Mr. Mee @ Apr 27th 2008 1:18PM
On a different note, I thought the first Nanostray was kind of annoying in terms of touch screen. The only way to switch weapons was to use the touch screen. This is a bullet hell game so why would you risk removing your fingers from d-pad control or the shooting button just to switch weapons? I found it quite annoying at least.
J.K. @ Apr 27th 2008 1:35PM
I got an easy three choices and they're all popular and sure to piss someone off that I've listed them.
1) Star Fox Command - Controls are a bit swishy though if you can get used to it accurate, but to not give a choice was bad as stylus only control can cramp a hand on that one due to the movements.
2) Zelda:PH - Totally and completely wrong in having it that way only just to suck up to the non-gamer group. Action games like this require precision and the stylus doesn't allow, also as many know some movements get confused by the slashing of the stylus causing an undesired effect at times.
3) Ninja Gaiden - It works great for a time, but then when you end up in locked up rooms with spikes around the outside you start to curse the game heavily due to the lack of precision to land a jump where you want or lack of an ability to terminate a roll before taking a poker in the pooper.
Coincidentally I've had all three, and the one that by far is hurt the least by this is Zelda. I just happened to get rid of it due to all the insipid backtracking to the ocean king temple after every little thing you do. Became a true chore and pain to always boat back, retread the same crap +1 floor that I just never touched it again and sold it months later. :(
Looking at others posts I want honorable mentions here for games where 'something' of it you need to do in the game is stuck on the panel:
- Final Fantasy CC:RoF
- Super Mario 64 DS
- Nanostray
- Juiced 2
- Castlevania:DoS (drawing to kill bosses within a time)
ArmiMaan @ Apr 27th 2008 2:15PM
Custom Robo Arena required you to tap the touch screen to activate "Soul Boost" during battle, which was really unnecessary because the [Y] button had absolutely nothing assigned to it. It didn't hamper the game experience much, but it sure was annoying.
ozone @ Apr 27th 2008 2:23PM
forced stylus? remember the smackdown vs raw... that was piece of crap!!!!!!!
chill penguin @ Apr 27th 2008 2:25PM
I must say, the controls of Zelda PH were a nice idea...
Nevertheless they were horrible to use since they were not precise enough to play a game like that (anyone else tried to ram that first tree for more than one minute and later rolled accidentally when fighting all the time?) and i caught myself trying to use the D-Pad alot (ALOT!). It just felt wrong.
Same goes with New Super Mario Bros.: why not map the "saved" mushroom/flower/whatever on L, R or Select? I guess that would've made too much sense...
Starfox Command is almost unplayable. Couldn't get into it, got rid of it.
I liked the touchscreen use in Rune Factory though. It made crafting alot more comfortable. That's how games should use the features of a console, to reduce chores (weird to say that talking about a Harvest Moon game) and not to turn the whole game into one as in Zelda PH.
Oh, and i also liked the Metroid controls!
fraeone @ Apr 27th 2008 3:07PM
Mario vs Donkey Kong 2!
Absolute worst offender. The first game controlled like a dream on GBA (one of my favorite GBA games ever) and in the second one, you have to stroke your player upwards to do a jump. It was a total disaster.
Sunfizz98 @ Apr 27th 2008 6:21PM
Luminous Arc - The fact that basically everything had to be done through the stylus is just wrong.
Keith @ Apr 27th 2008 7:27PM
Just a heads up but Luminous Arc actually has three different control schemes: right-handed stylus, left-handed stylus, and D-pad control. You can switch between the three in the Options menu or by pressing Select.
Jacksons @ Apr 27th 2008 8:29PM
Super Mario 64 DS analog/camera - awful.
New Super Mario spare item - awful (though I found pressing lightly on the plastic trim around the bottom right corner of the touchscreen works great.)
Zelda:PH rolling maneuver - awful.
moopa @ Apr 27th 2008 8:31PM
Nanostray 1 - Ruined by the use of stylus for weapons.
Frastoglegnia @ Apr 27th 2008 10:21PM
Interesting that so many people found PH's controls irksome -- perhaps because Wind Waker set their expectations unusually high.
The constant return to mazed locations and the imposition of a timer annoyed me more than the controls. Despite those flaws, I found the game fun and ingenious.
Dementium, on the other hand, was a promising game (with unusually evocative music) destroyed by an awkward three-handed interface. Moving through the space with a stylus while being forced to simultaneously alternate between a flashlight with which to see and a gun for protection with one half of one hand, while the other hand switches the light on, fires and examines? Ridiculous.
Dementium was also created in an historical vacuum, since the developers confused a clunky interface, infrequent save points and instant death for narrative tension. It was as if someone had created a survival horror game for the DS in the early nineties, and imagined people would be frightened by inconvenience.
My character might have been in danger, but so was the cart itself. Especially since I like to play next to the open window.
alberthegreat @ Apr 27th 2008 11:37PM
zelda phantom hourglass controls never felt right to me.....
Nixontech2071 @ Apr 28th 2008 2:07AM
Metroid hunters: Awful controls in general! But the D-pad is a long loved tradition of control variables. I somewhat believe the stylus only destroys the screen, I shouldnt have to buy screen protectors. They leave a bad image on the DS. Plus you have to be careful while putting them on.
I am NOT going to go through the trouble of buying an import screen protector from japan.
Professor Lario @ Apr 28th 2008 11:40AM
Final Fantasy: CC is a good game, but very frustrating. The dual-use of the touch screen and buttons make many of the special moves unusable.
Advance wars did a good job, but I hate having to go into a menu every time I end the turn. Oh wait, that is more a design issue, huh : )
Zeke @ Apr 30th 2008 1:34PM
Here's an oldie-but-goodie: Castlevania: Dawn of Sorrow. Its touchscreen controls were pure gimmick, forcing you to quickly grab your stylus and draw a sigil after beating each boss (with the buttons). Portrait of Ruin improved on this a bit by adding unlockable characters who control with the stylus, and mostly leaving touchscreen stuff out of the main game.
We could have a similar debate about gratuitous mic use. In my book, the winner hands down is Lunar: Dragon Song. The mic has exactly one use -- running from battles -- which wouldn't be so bad if it weren't also the *only* way to do so. Running is a basic RPG option that should be available with a minimum of annoyance.
Everyone who has cited Prime Hunters or Phantom Hourglass in this thread is missing the point so completely it boggles the mind.
J.K. @ May 4th 2008 8:51PM
Would the point be that if Nintendo tells you it's better that way you have to ignore every negative feeling you get about the control and just eat a turd sandwich with a smile on your face? I didn't have issue with Prime Hunters, that worked, and you had a CHOICE of pad or stylus. Zelda though deserves every cheap potshot it takes for the control and also as #33 said: "The constant return to mazed locations and the imposition of a timer annoyed me more than the controls."
Zeke @ May 8th 2008 2:45AM
It's not mindless fanboyism. I have better things to do than praise stuff I didn't actually like. My point is that Phantom Hourglass IS its controls; there's no separating them. The game is designed around the touchscreen so completely it's impossible to picture it as a d-pad/buttons game.
The topic of discussion is "forced stylus", and to me, that means having to use the touchscreen when alternatives could easily have been provided. MegaMan Star Force is a good example. You have to pulse into waveholes by tapping them, but since you can't do it from very far off, there's never a situation where using a button instead would be ambiguous. (The R button worked fine for Battle Network.)